Virginity

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Virginity

#76 Pufer

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Posted 18 November 2003 - 12:15 PM

Quote

Originally posted by Sundered Angel:
You see, I don't think it's the word "virgin" which people are so touchy about (at least, not the people I know). It's the word "have", with its connotations of possession. While that is fine in some circumstances - everyone knows that "having" a girlfriend equates with "having" a boyfriend - when it occurs in an unbalanced situation, it takes on subtle overtones.

I think that any implications of the word "have" in the situations we are dealing with have to be determined on a case to case basis. In the above case, Clueless clearly didn't mean to say that he had dominated or owned any virgins, and (as he has just alluded to) "have" just fits better within the sentence. You could just as easily say that "having" a girlfriend, to use your example, could imply some sort of domination of the female party in the relationship, yet the term "having a girlfriend" has managed to become part of the common lexicon. I really think "have" in this sense has also become commonplace in the same manner.

Quote

And let's face it - virginity is still primarily a girl's concern. Our society hasn't yet advanced to the point of sexual equality, despite having reached near legal equality.

There is a purely physical aspect which, as I see it, will not allow virginity to become a total non-issue amongst females, no matter how much society advances (again, I do see what you are saying though).

-Pufer

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#77 lobf

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Posted 18 November 2003 - 01:55 PM

Quote

Some things are best experienced by trying. Good luck.

gee, thanks so much everyone.

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#78 moonunit4eva

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Posted 18 November 2003 - 10:10 PM

OMG. How big do you think tampons are? THere's no way they could make you a non-virgin. I don't think...but to be honest, the only other way a girl can't bleed, is if she um...does stuff alone.

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#79 Pikeman

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Posted 18 November 2003 - 10:49 PM

I'd much rather marry someone who knew what the hell they were doing beforehand. Of course, I would never marry a virgin, anyway. Sex is an incredibly important part of any relationship. In fact, sex is pretty much the core of your chemistry. If that sexual chemistry isn't there, the relationship just won't work, no matter how much you love each other. If you don't at least have sex a few times before you get married, you might get stuck with someone whom you just can't connect with on that ever-so-important level. That said, I wouldn't buy a car that I hadn't test drove any more than I would marry a girl I'd never ****ed.

Oh yeah, and I'll be 20 in a couple of months, so getting married is still a ways off in my conscious perception.

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[This message has been edited by Pikeman (edited 11-18-2003).]

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#80 moonunit4eva

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Posted 18 November 2003 - 10:54 PM

Everybody's putting up great fights for both sides..crap..now I'm reading a sex book. WEll, It's called Gossip Girls...it's not helping...damnit..keep arguing, I need more to think about.

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The tables are empty, the dance floor's deserted, you play the same love song, it's the tenth time you've heard it. That's the beginning, just one of the clues, you've had your first lesson, in learnin' the blues!
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#81 Avatara

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Posted 18 November 2003 - 11:10 PM

Quote

Originally posted by moonunit4eva:
I need more to think about.

How about "the internet is hardly a good place to get sex advice."

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#82 Pikeman

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Posted 18 November 2003 - 11:16 PM

Quote

Originally posted by Avatara:
How about "the internet is hardly a good place to get sex advice."

It's better than women's magazines who's articles are written only to sell subscriptions by pandering to the insecurities of young women everywhere, giving no thought to whether or not what they're saying is actually true or not.

Not by much, though. Posted Image

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#83 Azeroth

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Posted 18 November 2003 - 11:18 PM

Quote

Originally posted by moonunit4eva:
..now I'm reading a sex book.

I speak for us all, or at least for me, when I say that this is REALLY not something we want to hear about!
That said, I do not feel comfortable really saying I would or would not marry someone solely based on virginity-I would have to know the person, see the person. Marriage is much to complex to boil down to something like a willingness to have sex with you beforehand. If they have been raised not to do that and would never agree to it but they are perfect in every other way, I would be happy to marry them. I don't think distinctions like this can be made.

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#84 The Journalist

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Posted 18 November 2003 - 11:49 PM

Y'know...

This topic has stayed on topic for 3 pages now.

I think that says something.

And it ain't good news.

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#85 Zortrium

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Posted 19 November 2003 - 12:01 AM

Quote

Originally posted by The Journalist:

I think that says something.

Human beings are very interested in sex? Posted Image

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#86 moonunit4eva

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Posted 19 November 2003 - 12:05 AM

ok, that came out wrong. IT's not a sex book it's just about teenage girls in new york who are sluts..better?

------------------
The tables are empty, the dance floor's deserted, you play the same love song, it's the tenth time you've heard it. That's the beginning, just one of the clues, you've had your first lesson, in learnin' the blues!
~Frank Sinatra
Maybe if you hadn't been smoking hobbit-weed, you would have noticed I've turned evil. ~Saruman
He seemed to be suffering from some sort of erectile disfunction. ~Mr. Ross

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#87 Zortrium

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Posted 19 November 2003 - 12:06 AM

Um....no. Not at all.

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#88 moonunit4eva

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Posted 19 November 2003 - 12:15 AM

The chapter titles are...An hour of sex burns 360 calories (someone said that's a proven fact) s&n, s is back!, yadda yadda.

------------------
The tables are empty, the dance floor's deserted, you play the same love song, it's the tenth time you've heard it. That's the beginning, just one of the clues, you've had your first lesson, in learnin' the blues!
~Frank Sinatra
Maybe if you hadn't been smoking hobbit-weed, you would have noticed I've turned evil. ~Saruman
He seemed to be suffering from some sort of erectile disfunction. ~Mr. Ross

Whatever happens..happens.

#89 Pufer

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Posted 19 November 2003 - 12:21 AM

Quote

Originally posted by Azeroth:
<stuff on the nature of marriage>

You've been brainwashed by modern western society with your view of marriage. The true institution of marriage has nothing to do with anything other than property rights, while your interpretation of the institution is based loosely on Constantine's reaction against the "Pagan" Roman Empire (as opposed to his "Holy" Roman Empire) as interpreted by various papal scholars and influenced by Augustine (with just a dash of modern idealist BS thrown in for good measure).

On the subject though, you are looking at the issue in about the same way that Pikeman is, but you are not acknowledging the nature of human existance. The only reason why you would consider someone "perfect" is in order to propogate the species (a compatable mate) in the most effective way possible. As sex is the logical conclusion of any such search for a compatible mate (to find out if you really are all that compatible, as Pikey said), why have sex after you have effectively given up any means to remove yourself from the relationship and have "staked your claim" (the true purpose of marriage throughout history)?

-Pufer

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#90 moonunit4eva

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Posted 19 November 2003 - 12:37 AM

I'm not sure if I followed that completely..but I see your point.

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The tables are empty, the dance floor's deserted, you play the same love song, it's the tenth time you've heard it. That's the beginning, just one of the clues, you've had your first lesson, in learnin' the blues!
~Frank Sinatra
Maybe if you hadn't been smoking hobbit-weed, you would have noticed I've turned evil. ~Saruman
He seemed to be suffering from some sort of erectile disfunction. ~Mr. Ross

Whatever happens..happens.

#91 vecoriwen

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Posted 19 November 2003 - 01:55 AM

Good point, Pufer. And I agree with you, but at the same time, I think has evolved from merely a way to gain property right, to a way to declare a commitment, of love and devotion.

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#92 lobf

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Posted 19 November 2003 - 09:00 AM

Quote

OMG. How big do you think tampons are? THere's no way they could make you a non-virgin. I don't think...but to be honest, the only other way a girl can't bleed, is if she um...does stuff alone.

okay
i have no idea how that cherry thing works. it completely boggles my mind. i figured shoving a tampon up ur ***** would be the same as shoving a d***. i need to read a book or something....or get a life

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#93 Azeroth

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Posted 19 November 2003 - 09:06 AM

Quote

Originally posted by Pufer:
You've been brainwashed by modern western society with your view of marriage.

Absolutely true.
As I think most of the other stuff you said was, but I didn't actually read all of it.

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#94 Pufer

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Posted 19 November 2003 - 04:21 PM

Quote

Originally posted by vecoriwen:
Good point, Pufer. And I agree with you, but at the same time, I think has evolved from merely a way to gain property right, to a way to declare a commitment, of love and devotion.

My question is why can't you just declare a commitment of love and devotion? I just cannot see, in today's modern society, why anyone would enter into an institution that has been so traditionally repressive of women and causes such a huge number of unnessisary problems today. As I see it, marriage is simply not nessisary any more. Really the only answer I've been able to come up with is that western religion is keeping it alive even though it has no reason to (yes, I am discounting tradition here, but why follow a tradition that is based on something that doesn't exist any longer).

Also, before it's asked (as the question always comes up whenever I write something like this), my parents have been happily married for 22 years and are not divorced, so I have no basis for a personal, non-objective problem with marriage.

Quote

Originally posted by Azeroth:
As I think most of the other stuff you said was, but I didn't actually read all of it.

Yeah, I figure that most people don't make it all the way through my posts. Posted Image

-Pufer

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#95 Pallas Athene

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Posted 19 November 2003 - 04:46 PM

Quote

Actually, I think the most appropriate way would be "I've slept with..." But I still don't have any problem with "I've had," given its idiomatic nature.

On the subject of getting rid of marriage... to me, it would seem that that would create a culture of "screw the girl and move on." The tendency towards this already exists, but I don't see any reason we should deliberately move ourselves towards that sort of situation.

Don't be surprised if this is my last post in this topic; some of this just makes me feel sick.

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#96 Avatara

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Posted 19 November 2003 - 06:14 PM

Quote

Originally posted by moonunit4eva:
The chapter titles are...An hour of sex burns 360 calories (someone said that's a proven fact) s&n, s is back!, yadda yadda.

There's a researcher who claims couples can get all the exercise they need to be healthy just from having sex 45 minutes for two days a week.

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#97 The Journalist

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Posted 19 November 2003 - 06:44 PM

Quote

Originally posted by Pufer:
Yeah, I figure that most people don't make it all the way through my posts.

That was the only part i saw...

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#98 Pikeman

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Posted 19 November 2003 - 07:39 PM

Quote

Originally posted by moonunit4eva:
ok, that came out wrong. IT's not a sex book it's just about teenage girls in new york who are sluts..better?

Better fuel for a campfire than for actually reading, I'm sure.

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#99 GandalfDaddy

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Posted 19 November 2003 - 11:07 PM

Or toilet paper.

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#100 Sundered Angel

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Posted 20 November 2003 - 12:45 AM

Quote

Originally posted by lotsofblackflags:
okay
i have no idea how that cherry thing works. it completely boggles my mind. i figured shoving a tampon up ur ***** would be the same as shoving a d***. i need to read a book or something....or get a life

Argument #1 for comprehensive sex-ed in school.

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